Note: you may see some lines that say the following in this file: * * COPY DISK ERROR * * This was caused by a bad diskette in the system. The data in those lines was lost due to disk errors. NUMBER OF LINES: 626 1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask.... 2 ************************ REMOVED: 22 MAR 83 ************************ 3 Welcome to BWMS (BackWater Message System) Mike Day System operator 4 ************************************************************ 5 GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION PLACED ON 6 THIS SYSTEM. 7 BWMS was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS is a privatly owned 8 and operated system which is currently open for use by the general public. 9 No restrictions are placed on the use of the system. 10 It is intended that the system be normally used for messages and 11 advertisments by the users. As the system is privatly owned, I retain the 12 right to remove any and all messages from the system which are offensive 13 to me. Additionally because of the limited size of the system, it will be 14 periodically purged of older messages. (only 629 lines of data can be saved) 15 The saved information will be cycled to drive 'B' while the information on 16 drive 'B' will be archived, and a fresh disk will be installed in drive 'A'. 17 To leave a message, type 'ENTER' and use ctrl/C or break to get out 18 of the enter mode. The message is automaticly stored. 19 If after entering the message you find you made a mistake, 20 use the replace command to replace the line. 21 To exit from the system, type 'OFF' then hang up. 22 Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system. 23 ======================================== 24 25 TO ALL USERS: FM: CISTOP MIKEY 26 RE: CURRENT ARGUMENT IN REGARD TO VALS USING SYSTEM 27 28 FIRST PLEASE NOTE THAT THE MESSAGES HAVE NOT BEEN REMOVED, IF I FOUND 29 THEM OFFENSIVE TO ME I WOULD HAVE REMOVED THEM. SINCE THEY ARE STILL 30 THERE, NEED I SAY MORE? 31 WHILE I DON'T FIND THE MESSAGES TO BE OF MAJOR INTEREST TO ME PERSONALY, 32 I SEE NO POINT IN JAMMING MY IDEAS OF WHAT IS ENJOYABLE DOWN SOMEONE ELSES 33 THROAT. THIS SYSTEM IS AFTER ALL OPEN TO THE 'GENERAL PUBLIC' AND NOT 34 RESTRICTED TO A NARROW GROUP OF HIGHBROWS. IT IS THIS VERY NON-RESTRICTIVE 35 NATURE OF THE SYSTEM THAT HAS MADE IT UNIQUE AND SEPERATE FROM THE 36 OTHER SYSTEMS. 37 AND NOW BACK TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDUALED PROGRAM. HAPPY ARGUING... 38 ******* CISTOP MIKEY ***** 6 MARCH 83 ****************************** 39 Like Hi Mikey, 40 43 45 THE VAL GAL 46 ################################################################ 47 IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THE VERY CONCEPT OF DISCUSSING WHAT TYPES OF PEOPLE 48 SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO USE THIS SYSTEM SMACKS OF INTOLLERANCE AND HATRED. 49 MIKE IS THE ONLY PERSON WHO HAS ANY RIGHT TO DECIDE THAT BECAUSE THIS SYSTEM 51 THIS SYSTEM TO MIKE THANK YOU 52 ME 53 54 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 55 56 Mike, I just got a "DISK ERR in line 54" msg. Hope it ain't serious! 57 .............................................................. 58 ******************************************************************************* 59 60 61 62 MIKE, I JUST GOT IT ALSO 63 TIME 11:45AM 03/07/83 64 SAC TROOP 65 ****************************************************************************** 66 67 I AM GOING TO DISKS ON MY TRASH-80 MOD III, AND I AM TRYING TO GET ALL THE 68 INFO I CAN AHEAD OF TIME. ANY GOT ANY GOOD SUGGESTIONS OR COMMENTS ???? 69 70 KIRK 71 72 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 73 good luck,kirk 74 stop 75 list 76 77 78 79 help 80 ATTENTION ALL DOG LOVERS !!!!!! 81 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 82 83 FREE KEESHOND !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 84 85 WHAT IS A KEESHOND YOU SAY ?? 86 87 WELLL,SINCE YOU ASKED.......... 88 IT IS ABOUT THE SAME SIZE AND 89 LOOKS AS A SAMOYED XCEPT IS BLACK 90 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 91 WITH KIDS. PUPS GO FOR ABOUT $200 92 BUT I'LL GIVE THE RIGHT PERSON MY 93 5 YR OLD ONE FOR FREE. 94 CALL TOM AT 253-xxxx IF INTERESTED. 95 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 96 TO THE USER THAT HAD A QUESTION IN REGARD TO MOD III DISK DRIVES... 97 98 I DON'T OWN ANY MYSELF (I DON'T HAVE A TRS-80), BUT I USE THEM EVERY WEEKDAY. 99 THEy ARE REASONABLY DEPENDABLE, TRSDOS IS A POWERFUL O.S. AND THEY HAVE A GREAT 100 (BUT NOT TOO UNUSUAL) AMOUNT OF HIGH SPEED STORAGE, ABOUT 170-180K FORMATTED 101 STORAGE. MY ONLY COMPLAINT IS THAT THE DOS GIVES YOU ERROR NUMBERS INSTEAD OF 102 MESSAGES, BUT BY TYPING ERROR ## (wHERE ## IS THE ERROR NUMBER THAT wAS RECIEvED 103 ) THE COMPUTER WILL PRINT THE ERROR MESSAGE AFTER READING A FILE TO FIND IT OUT 104 105 THE DISK IS STANDARD FORMAT (256 BYTES PER SECTOR, 5 SECTORS PER GRANULE), BUT 106 IS NOT COMPATABLE WITH THE MOD I IN ANY WAY, HOWEVER A PROGRAM CALLED CONVERT 107 WILL CONVERT PROGRAMS ON A MOD I DISK TOMOD III FORMAT (BY LOADING THEM OFF OF 108 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 109 THE MOD I DISK AND TRANSFERING IT TO THE MOD III DISK. THIS REQ. 2 DISK DRIVES. 110 111 ANYWAY, FOR THE INITIAL COST, A DISK DRIVE FOR THE MOD III IS WELL WORTH THE 112 INVESTMENT... THAT GOES FOR ANY COMPUTER... 113 114 ONE PROBLEM THAT I SHOULD MENTION, 115 IS THAT THE MOD III PASSWORD PROTECTION SYSTEM IS VERY DIFICULT TO GET AROUND. 116 IN FACT, IF YOU PROTECT A PROGRAM WITH A PASSWORD, AND THEN FORGET THE PASSwORD, 117 THEN YOU ARE PRETTY MUCH OUT OF LUCK. IT IS POSSIBLE TO KILL THE PROGRAM WITH 118 THE DISK MASTER PASSORD (IF YOU KNOW IT), BUT THAT DOESN'T HELP MUCH. 119 120 THE DISK IS FORMATTED AS DOUBLE DENSITY, SINGLE SIDED, 40 TRACKS. 121 122 ******** THE SYSM, DAVID GREENMAN ******** 03/07/83 10:52:00 PM ******** 123 124 MIKE, I AM GETTING A LOT OF ERRORS (READ AND WRITE) WHEN READING/WRITING A 125 MESSAGE. DID YOU BUY A CHEAP DISK? OR ARE YOU POSSIBLY REUSING OLD ONES? 126 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 127 128 I HAD TO EDIT THE ABOVE TEXT SO IT MADE SENCE WHEN YOU READ IT (THE SYSTEM 129 DROPING LINES DOES WONDERS FOR THE INTELLIGIBILITY OF WHAT WAS SAID...) 130 131 THE SYSM..... 132 133 THIS IS AN 134 WHAT KIND OF COMPUTER DOES THIS BULLITIN BOARD RUN ON? 135 136 137 MIKE RECIEVED 3 OR FOR ERRORS WHILE 138 READING BOARD 139 WILL CALL BACK WITH NUMBERS 140 EXIT 141 OFF 142 MIKE RECIEVED ERROR LINES IN #54,72,90,108,126 143 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 144 NOW A MESSAGE: 145 DOES ANYONE OUT THERE KNOW OF SOMEONE OR SOMETHING 146 USING A HARD DRIVE ON THE TRS COLOR COMPUTER???? 159 It almost seems like the "Disk Errors" are there with some human 160 assistance. Their placement is just too coincidental... 161 * * COPY DISK ERROR * * 162 |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| 163 DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT METHOD OF SCRAMBLING ONTV USES. I AM GOING TO GET SOME 164 BOOKS ON THE SUBJECT BUT I WOULDN'T COMPLAIN IF SOMEONE WAS TO GIVE ME A FEW 165 WHY DOES THIS MACHINE DROP OUT OF THE ENTER MODE? 166 MY OBSERVATIONS TELL ME THAT THE SOUND MUST BE ON A SUBCARRIER AND MAYBE 167 THAT SAME SUBCARRIER HAS THE MISSING VIDEO THAT THE BAND OF SNOW REPRESENTS. 168 WELL THAT'S ALL I KHAVE SO FAR ON THA SUBJECT. 169 PITHE PIRATE 170 178 TO: ALL USERS FM: CISTOP MIKEY RE: DISK ERRORS 179 SORRY ABOUT THE DISK ERRORS, SEEMS I GOT A BAD DISK 180 AND IT WAS A BRAND NEW SCOTCHY TOO! 181 NOTE THAT THE ERRORS OCCURED EVERY 18 SECTORS. ALSO NOTE THAT MY 182 FORMAT IS 18 SECTORS PER TRACK, AND YOU CAN SEE WHAT HAPPENED. 183 ....... CISTOP MIKEY .... 8 MAR 83 ..................... 184 TO: ALL USERS 185 SUBJECT: SOFTWARE 186 IF YOU HAVE ANY SOFTWARE YOU ARE INTERESTED IN GETTING LEAVE A MESSA 187 SHOULD BE ABLE TO BEAT ANY PRICE 188 Dear Mikey: 189 Get that bad disky to WRAM. We love to feed them to the rep. but 190 don't find nearly enough to meet our demand... 191 t.P.G. 192 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 193 DEAR P.G. SORRY, I REFORMATTED IT AND EVERYTHINGS SEEMS TO BE HUNKY DORY 194 BUT WE WILL SEE, I WILL BE CYCLING IT BACK TO BWMS ON THE NEXT DISK 195 CHANGE. MAYBE IT JUST DOSEN'T LIKE THE POOR OL' SHUGARTS BWMS USES. 196 (IT WAS A DD DS DH DISK TO BOOT!) 197 ++++++++++ CISTOP MIKEY ++++++ 9 MAR 83 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 198 Dear Mikey: 199 You aren't actually spending money on Double Side Double Density? 200 THERE AIN'T NO REASON! 3M only makes one kind of 5 1/4" diskette. 201 Only the labels are changed.... 202 t.P.G 203 ..............................................1853..3.10.83................ 204 TRUE, BUT I USED TO USE SS DISKS, AND WAS EXPERIENCING ABOUT 20% FAILURE 205 ON THE BACK SIDE, SO WENT TO THE DD JUST TO NOT HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE 206 AGRAVATION OF IT ALL. 207 .......... CISTOP MIKEY .............. 10 MAR 83 ........................ 208 MIKE, HOW MUCH STORAGE PER DRIVE DO YOU HAVE ON THIS SYSTEM? AND WHAT KIND OF 209 COMPUTER ARE USING? ARE YOU USING ANY SPECIAL EQUIPMENT (HOMEBREW)?? 210 211 ELUCIDATE... 212 213 THE SYSM.........03/10/83 22:39:00......... 214 215 ............................................................... 216 AS INDICATED IN THE OPENING MESSAGE, THE DRIVES HOLD 629 LINES 217 OF DATA (AS OPPOSED TO CHARACTERS) THE SYSTEM IS AN OLD DATA 218 ENTRY MACHINE BUILT BY EDGE TECHNOLOGY AND MODIFIED SLIGHLY BY 219 YOURS TRUELY FOR THIS APPLICATION 220 IT USES 2 SHUGART SA400 DISK DRIVES, 1K OF RAM (YES ONLY 1K!) 221 8K OF EPROM (2708) IN WHICH THE SYSTEM PROGRAM RESIDES 222 AND ALL OF THIS IS CONTROLED BY AN 8080 PROCESSOR. THE MODEM 223 IS A PCS-103 CONFIGURED FOR AUTOANSWER. 224 ...... CISTOP MIKEY ........ 10 MAR 83 ..................... 225 ABOUT THOSE ONLY ONE KIND OF DISK BY 3M 226 THAT IS MOST LIKELY TRUE BUT---------------> 227 THEY ONLY CERT. THE DISK FOR WHAT THEY SELL IT AT. 228 IF IT WILL CERT 80T DD/DD THEN IT IS THAT. IF ONLY ONE SIDE WILL 229 THEN IT'S 80T SS/DD ,IF IT WONT GO 80T THEY TRY 40T ETC ALL THE WAY 230 DOWN TO USELESS. 231 232 KIRK 233 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 234 About that Certification.... 235 The 3M rep has admitted to me that the diskettes are certified "statisticaly" 236 You don't have a problem except when a BATCH of media has been down graded. 237 This is why one whole box can have problems, different job lots. The "cer- 238 tification" is actually a warranty, if it don't work as advertised, it will 239 be replaced. 240 On that vein, I was told by a customer that he had bought 3M diskettes from 241 the Sears Business Center for $45.00 [on sale!] and one of them would not 242 format. On return he was told by the clerk "tough". So much for reputable 243 dealers... 244 the Phantom Glitch., 245 }}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}18.45}}{{3{11{83{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{ 246 DEAR VAL GAL, 247 LIKE TOTALY BARFED OUT THE OTHER 248 DAY,LIKE MY LIKE BROTHER CAME IN 249 ND LIKE TERRORIZED MY LIKE ROOM!!! 250 IKE SO HOW HAVE YOU LIKE BEEN LIKE 251 ATELY?????LIKE HAVENT LIKE SEEN YA 252 N THE LIKE SYSTEM LIKE LATELY,LIKE 253 HAT HAPPENED???????AS FOR VAL HATERS, 254 IKE YOULL LIKE NEVER LIKE GET RID OF 255 S!!!!.......H-A-!!!!!!!!!!WELL LIKE 257 O LONG((FOR NOW)) 258 TOTALY, 259 MOON U. 260 W/B 262 VAL GAL 263 .S. EVER LIKE WWATCH 264 MV3????????? 265 ............................................................... 266 The problems "THE SYSM" (David Greenman) mentioned regarding TRSDOS 267 are easily solved by some simple patches. If you need them 268 leave me a msg here or on Bit Bucket or CBBS. 269 By the way David, Mod III TRSDOS uses 3 (not 5) sectors per 270 gran, 6 grans per track. 271 Leonard Erickson 272 .............................................................. 273 274 TO LEONARD ERICKSON: 275 I WOULD BE INTERESTED IN THE PATCHES MYSELF. I AM NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE 276 INTER WORKINGS OF TRSDOS, (I HAVE NEVER DISASSEMBLED IT) I ALSO APPRECIATE THE 277 OTHER INFO... 278 279 THE SYSM. 280 281 ================================================== 15:14:00 03/12/83 ========== 282 DEAR MIKEY: If there was a command on BWMS to do a global search and 283 replace, the VG messages could very simply be rendered into fairly good 284 English. (#*<............................ 344 345 346 347 AS WE MOVE AHEAD IN THIS ADMINISTRATION WE ARE PRESENTLY LIVING UNDER 348 ,IT BECOMES OBVIOUS THAT IT IS PRO-BUSINESS AND VERY ANTI UNION AS 349 THEY TIGHTEN THE CHOKE HOLD ON THE AMERICAN PEOPLE-CREATING A SYSTEM 350 OF HAVES AND HAVENOTS-PITTING THEM AGAINST EACH OTHER.KETCUP AS A 351 VEGTABLE SOUNDS GOOD ON PAPER BUT NOT VERY WILL IN PRACTICE.AS THE 352 PROBLEMS MOUNT HERE AT HOME ,IT SEEMS WE KEEP SENDING THE RESOURCES 353 THAT COULD HELP THE PROBLEM HERE TO OTHER COUNTRIES-IT IS "AID" AS 354 THEY CALL IT OR JUST MORE AGITATION IN THE GOVT. SYSTEMS OF OTHER 355 COUNTRIES-BECAUSE I PERSONALLY DON'T SEE THE PEOPLE WE ARE SUPPOSE 356 TO BE HELPING BENIFIT FROM THIS AID BUT JUST A INCREASE IN THE 357 AGGRESSION AGAINST THE COMMON PERSON BY MILITARY POWER STRUCTURES. 359 360 AMERICA IS FOR SALE NOW!!!!!!!!!!!BUY NOW WHILE THE PRICE IS RIGHT 361 THE TIME TO PARTICIPATE IS NOW BY BEING ACTIVE IN VOTING AND TELL- 362 THE PEOPLE WE HAVE VOTED INTO DIFFERENT OFFICES WHAT "WE" WANT DONE 363 THERE IS POWER IN NUMBERS-IF WE DON'T-IN THE END WE WILL BE THE 364 LOSERS BY NON-PARTICIPATION. THE CONSTITUTION STATES THAT-"WE THE 365 PEOPLE ARE THE GOVERNMENT". LET'S CANCEL OUT APATHY AND START CHANGE 366 NOW.THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH LARGE OR SMALL COMPANIES MAKING 367 BIG PROFITS BUT WHEN THE GOING GETS ROUGH OR SOME COUNTRY DECIDES 368 TO NATIONALIZE THEIR COMPANIES-LET THEM NOT START EXPORTING JOBS 369 AND ASKING FOR SUBSIDIES AND HAVING OUR MILITARY GET INVOLVED BUT 370 START TAKING CARE OF THERE WORKERS AND CONSUMERS AT HOME. A STRONG 371 MILITARY BUDGET WITH ARMS WILL NOT PROTECT THE COMMON PERSON WHO 372 HAS LOST HIS JOB,UN-EMPLOYMENT BENIFITS ,HIS HOUSE AND POSSIBLY 373 HIS FAMILY AND SELF-WORTH TOO.BECAUSE THE WORKER IS THE CORE OF 374 THE SYSTEM. 375 376 SOUND RADICAL-NOT REALLY IF YOU STOP TO THINK ABOUT IT. 377 378 379 |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| 380 Sadly, there seems to be little showing me why a policy of anti-union 381 practices is not justified. Unions have had their time and place, but 382 I feel the time is past and the place is lost. I'm not for all out 383 exploitation of the worker (blue- or white-collar) on the part of the 384 corporation. Neither can I condone exploitation of the workers by the 385 very people they elected or hired to watch out for their interests. 386 Stop and think about it... is a guy screwing on rear-view mirrors in 387 Detroit really worth $10 per hour or more?? Who is benefitting from 388 these overly inflated wages? 389 {}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{} Analog Alan {}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{} 390 ::::::::::::::::::::::::: 391 Ditto. If you know what the Robinson-Patman Act is (government jobs 392 must pay the 'prevailing' (ie, UNION) wage rate), you'll understand why 393 the government needs to be less pro-union. By the way, unions are 394 specifically exempted from the Sherman anti-trust act. Why? The 395 Sherman anti-trust act prohits 'restraint of trade.' I.E., no 396 monopolies. However, a union is the most obvious monopoly there is. 397 That act was intended by unions to be a weapon against business, but 398 they soon found out they were even more obvious violators. So Congress 399 had to jump in and specifically exempt unions. Anti-union? C'mon now, 400 I WISH congress was anti-union. 401 If you want to complain about something, complain about taxes. 402 The Constitution prohibits 'involuntary servitude' (slavery) yet 403 taxes are clearly intended to be involuntary, and represent a portion 404 of one's efforts and wealth. 405 Challenge to all: Give me a definition of the word 'THEFT' 406 that does not also include taxation. Example definition: Theft is 407 the involuntary removal of property from some person or organization 408 . Clearly, this definition includes taxation. Can you find one that 409 doesn't? Probably not. 410 Don't assume that government should be able to do things no 411 individual can do. Just because it's government does not make its 412 actions legal. 413 414 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: 415 I wish the real world wa as simple as the last few messages imply. There 416 is a lot to be said against militarism, but without an army we would be 417 overrun immediately. Taxation is not theft, as that is "illegally taking, 418 and by definition taxes are legal. There is more to it than that, of 419 course, but lets not worry too much about defining theft, only about 420 preventing it. (We all know what it is.) As to taxes, we all hate them, 421 but can't live without them. The government of the US may not be perfect, 422 or even quite what we want, but try some of the others: do you really 423 want to live in Siberia? As to stampimg out apathy, so you really want 424 to? Remember, the nonvote makes yours more powerful. And be glad they 425 aren't voting, because those who aren't would vote for more subsidies 426 (for themselves), and that means more taxes. 427 =================================the voice of moderation==3/14/83======== 428 HAVE I MISSED SOMETHING? US HILL FOLKS DON'T COME TO TOWN OFTEN ENOUGH TO 429 KEEP UP WITH THE GARBAGE HERE ON BWMS, AND ALL I SEE IS ANSWERS TO THE VALS. 430 WHAT DID THE VALS SAY?? OR AM I ALLOWED TO ASK?? 431 _^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^_^ 432 YEAH!!!! AT LAST A GOOD OLD FASIONED ARGUMENT ON BWMS!!! YEAH!!!!!!!!! 433 .>>>>>>>........................>>>...............>>>............>>>.......... 434 ................................................................................ 435 Dead Drive Here: 436 I only recently accessed this BBS the first time to get information on Rana 437 drives. However this free exchange of ideas is interesting. I'll stay tuned 438 for more. By the way I'am still interested in any comments about Rana drives. 439 ...................................3/15/83..............12:00:00................ 440 DON'T BE MISLED, DEAD DRIVE. USUALLY THERE IS MUCH MORE DEAD AROUND THIS 441 BOARD THAN MECHANICAL THINGS: MENTAL PROWESS AND DISCIPLINED RATIONALE HAVE 442 SINCE PASSED AWAY...FAR AWAY...FROM MOST OF THESE USERS. HUMBUG 443 EXIT 444 -------------------------------------------------3/15/83--------------- 445 MRC- Wht exactly do you mean by Source Generator - does it create 446 source from machine code (i.e. dissassembler) ? 447 448 To all of you ONTV pirates - 449 ONTV uses a gated pulse sync-suppressed scrambling system with an 450 intermittent inverting , random interval inverting signal. The audio signal is, from 451 what I understand, is on a 39.XXXX MHz subcarrier. I don't have the info. 452 with me right now, when; when I go home I'll get it and tell you all of the 453 goodies about scrambling techniques. 454 The Cosmic Connection 455 ()())()()()()()()()()()()())()()() 456 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ 457 Dear Dead Drive; 458 My friend the Apple Mechanic says RANA's are neat but too smart for 459 their own good. They have problems with the "half track" and "psuedo- 460 sector" nonsense used to protect games and other such software. They wk 461 neat, rather expensive, and look good. I baught Micro-Sci A2's from 462 the Hollywood Computer Center. Bill gave me such a deal! They seem to 463 work exactly like Apple drives, not well, mind you, but just like Apple. 464 the Phantom Glitch 465 P.S. Computerland in Tigard had some around, they might want to deal... 466 //////////////////////////////////////////////3/15/83/////////////////// 467 REPONSE TO ANALOG ALAN- 468 469 THE IDEAS ABOUT GOVERNMENT AND THE MITITARY WHERE NOT MEANT TO STATE 470 THAT A SYSTEM OF PROTECTION VIA A "ARMY" WAS AGAINST OUR OWN BEST IN- 471 TEREST OR GOOD,BUT IN THE MANNER IN WHICH THEY ARE USED ON A WORLD 472 BASIS.THIS IS NOT A QUESTION OF WHICH SYSTEM WE USE, BUT WHAT WE CAN 473 DO TO CHANGE THEM AND THERE USE FOR THE BEST INTEREST OF EVERYONE ON 474 THIS PLANET POSSIBLE.IT IS NOT A QUESTION OF WHERE YOU WANT TO LIVE 475 OR WHAT POLITICAL SYSTEM YOU LIVE UNDER-YOU WILL STILL BE AFFECTED BY 476 THOSE FORCES.THE POINT IS THAT MORE INVOLVEMENT BY PEOPLE CAN CHANGE 477 THINGS THAT WE INCOUNTER EVERY DAY AND REALLY HAVE A EFFECT.I CAN 478 AGREE AND RELATE TO YOUR STATEMENT ON UNIONS BUT THE HISTORICAL 479 BACKGROUND OF MANGEMENT AND WORKER GO WAY BACK BEFORE JOE HILL AND 480 THE WOBBLIES , AND THERE HAS AND ALWAYS WILL BE THE GAP PROFIT AND 481 WAGES AND THE QUESTION OF PRODUCTION.WHO IS SERVING WHO AND FOR WHAT 482 PURPOSE. 483 484 485 YOUR RESPONSE WAS RECIEVED AND INTERESTING-THANK YOU,THE O.J.KID. 486 487 ........................................................................... 488 TO: ? 489 FROM: MRC 490 SUBJECT: SOURCE GENERATOR 491 TO PUT IT SUCCINCTLY;I'M LOOKING FOR A ASSEMBLY PROGRAM FOR 6502 THAT CREATES 492 A SOURCE 'FILE' WITH MNEMONIC & OPERHAND INSTRUCTIONS FROM A OBJECT FILE OR 493 PROGRAM,SO I CAN THEN ENTER THE SOURCE 'FILE' INTO A MACRO ASSEMBLER EDITOR. 494 THEN RE-EDIT THE OLD OBJECT PROGRAM. THE KEY HERE IS TO CREATE A NEW SOURCE 495 FILE NOT JUST DISSASSEMBLE THE OBJECT CODE. CONFUSED?? I AM !! 496 ...............................................3/15/83...................... 497 ======================== 498 Contrary to the above statement, taxes are not necessarily legal. 499 Obviously, it is possible for governments to do illegal things: 500 most obvious example, Watergate, segregation (Dred Scot decision), 501 internment of Japanese in WW2, theft of Indian lands. Our 502 Constitution prohibits taking property from a person without a hearing, 503 yet we are told we must pay taxes with no such hearing. 504 I repeat: Do NOT assume that because the government does it, 505 it's legal. Second, taxation is a form of somewhat diluted slavery, as 506 is the draft. Normally, when a citizen is a victim of a robbery, the 507 government will aid in bringing the crook to justice. However, when 508 it's government doing the stealing, not only can you not get justice, 509 but if you attempt to resist this theft, they can and will put you 510 in jail, etc. 511 No, we (the taxpayers) don't need taxes. The only ones 512 that need taxes are the leeches in our society who expect to live 513 at the expense of others. The system is quite predictable: If you 514 give people votes on the basis of 1 vote/person, you can expect that 515 people will tend to vote to steal money from the well-off minority. 516 This is human nature, as far as I can tell. 517 If one person steals from you, that's robbery. If a hundred 518 do it, that's a riot. If a million do it, that's taxes. 519 My challenge still is open: Make a general definition of 'theft' 520 that does NOT also include taxation. So far it appears no one has done 521 so, which is not surprising. Remember, governments can steal just as 522 effectively as individual, even more so in many circumstances. The 523 only fundamental difference is that governments are often never 524 punished for that theft. 525 ========================================================== 526 Since you have chosen to call taxes "theft" you will not accept the truth, 527 so I will not try to dissuade you. The rest of you reading this, please 528 ignore the preceeding. Taxes are how we pay for things we want to use 529 by all (or most of ) the people, like protection (army, etc.), public 530 roads, crime protection (police and courts), and what are called 531 "social programs" (such as unemployement compensation and poverty programs, 532 as well as a lot of others we don't hear as much about). If you want 533 crime prevention it is necessary to pay for it, and fire departments 534 don't come cheap. 535 Those who have not lived long enough to have experienced being without 536 money usually don' 537 t like what they call "dole" or "give-away", but those who have needed 538 them are often more reasonable. In any case it is important for crime 539 prevention to reducer poverty. 540 Not all that those in the government are doing legal things, but 541 this can not be called actions of the government. Nixon was a criminal, 542 not the US government. Don't confuse the two. "They" is a convenient 543 enemy, but when it includes both bad and good it is not correct. 544 In other words: GROW UP! 545 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++B.A.D.++3-16-83+++1600pm+++++ 546 TO: MIKE DAY 547 SJ: AMODEM AT 19200 548 FM: A.TRENT 549 HI MIKE, JUST THIS NOTE TO LET YOU KNOW I GOT AMODEM RUNNING FINE 550 BETWEEN MY CCS AND KAYPRO AT 9600 BAUD. GREAT!! MY PROBLEM WAS 551 THAT I PUT A BAUD RATE INIT IN THE "SETMOD" ROUTINE (TO 19200 552 WISHFULLY) AND DIDN'T THINK YOU WERE CALLING SETMOD ANYWHERE BUT 553 ONCE INITIALLY IN AMODEM. I FIXED THINGS BY PUTTING A "FIRSTTIME" 554 FLAG IN SETMOD. ONCE I GOT THE COMPUTERS TALKING TO EACH OTHER AT 555 THE SAME BAUD...19200 BAUD DON'T GO--YOU WERE RIGHT. I'M CURIOUS 556 TO SEE WHAT FEATURES THE NEXT VERSION OF AMODEM WILL HAVE. 557 =============================16MAR83 -- A.TRENT=================== 558 TO B.A.D AND OTHER ON GOVERNMENT... 559 GOVERNMENT IS A COERCIVE JURISDICTIONAL MONOPOLY. THIS IS A VIEW 560 POPULAR AMONG LIBERTARIANS. I THINK IT IS A VERY GOOD DEFINITION. 561 THERE IS A VAST VOLUME OF LITERATURE SHOWING THAT THE SERVICES 562 WE CURRENTLY ATTRIBUTE TO GOVERNMENT CAN AND SHOULD BE PROVIDED 563 BY A FREE MARKET. AS FAR AS TAXATION IS CONCERNED IT RELYS ON A 564 PROCESS OF INITIATION OF FORCE BY THE GOVERNMENT. THAT MAKES 565 TAXATION INDISTINGUISHABLE FROM THEFT. IN MY OPINION, GOVERNMENT 566 IS THE WORST HOAX THAT HAS EVER BEEN PERPETRATED ON AND BY 567 MANKIND. THROUGHOUT HISTORY GOVERNMENTS HAVE CAUSED UNTOLD MISERY 568 AND OCEANS OF BLOOD. ALL BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE (AND ARE) TO 569 IGNORANT TO ACHIEVE GOALS THROUGH PRODUCTIVE MEANS RATHER THAN 570 THRU THE INITIATION OF FORCE. THE "GROW UP" ARGUMENT IS THE 571 FIRST RESORT OF THOSE WHO SEEK TO DIRECT ATTENTION AWAY FROM 572 THEIR OWN NAIVETE BY ACCUSING OTHERS OF THEIR OWN FAILING. 573 FOR THOSE INTERESTED IN STUDYING WHETHER GOVERNMENT IS NECESSARY 574 AT ALL I SUGGEST THEY CONTACT THE LOCAL LIBERTARIAN PART AT 575 281-xxxx -- AT LEAST THAT USED TO BE THEIR NUMBER. ALSO A VERY 576 GOOD BOOK (AVAILABLE THROUGH MOST LIBERTARIAN PARTY HEADQUARTERS) 577 IS: "SOCIETY WITHOUT GOVERNMENT" BY TANNEHILL AND WOLLSTEIN. 578 ==========================16MAR83 - A.TRENT==================== 579 ##################################################################### 597 ================================================================== 598 Just this quick addendum to my previous diatribe on government-- 599 the CORRECT number for the Oregon Libertarian Party is 245 xxxx 600 in Portland. Also, for a source of the currently massive and 601 growing amount of Libertarian liturature send away for a catalog to: 602 LAISSEZ FAIRE BOOKS 603 206 Mercer St. 604 New York, N.Y. 10012 605 =================================7pm - 16MAR83 - A.TRENT======== 606 Although I normally don't get into this sort of argument, (it is the surest 607 way of getting people mad at you!) I would like to point out that while many 608 services can indeed be handled by the government, that does not mean that it 609 is nesecarily the best way. Take social security many think of this as a god 610 send. To the less financial responsible yes it is, but to those who bust thier 611 rears in life it is near worthless. So I have to pay for someone to leach off 612 of me because they were too irresponsible in thier early years to consider 613 what they were going to live on when they retire. In the case of fire 614 departments, I might point out that most rural fire departments are run 615 on a volunter basis with little or no tax support. The same with ambulance 616 and rescue services, and in some cases police. How do they handle this? 617 Well, in some cases the little support that is needed is indeed payed for 618 thru taxes, but this is only agreed on by the community at large not forced 619 down their throats by some burocrat who has never even seen the place let 620 alone be aware of their needs. Another way is for the individual to pay for 621 the service just like you would any other service contract. The cost? about 622 $5.00 a month for fire service, and comperable amounts for the others. What 623 if you don't pay? well you can still get the service you will just be charged 624 for the call, just like any other service. Many would say at first that this 625 could never work, but it can and in fact is in many communities. An intersting 626 side effect is it seems to bring the communities closer together. So what