Apollo BBS Archive

Apollo BBS Archive - July 24, 1987


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Message: 1600
Author: $ David Burkhart
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Howerton/Lesson
Date: 07/23/87  Time: 23:30:01

It took you long enough to learn that...

Message: 1601
Author: $ James Taranto
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Art
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 00:09:11

You mealy-mouthed little critics have no business judging my work.

Message: 1602
Author: $ Apollo SYSOP
Category: Answer!
Subject:  board...?
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 01:11:05

        Well, it looks like there may be one after all...  Lets hear from a
few more users.

ClifFART

Message: 1603
Author: $ Mark Adkins
Category: Question?
Subject: Howerton/Dark Tower
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 01:53:54

Donald M. Grant edition?
 
You're right of course, about King's first hardcover editions. I can't stand
him (and won't collect him), but I wouldn't be above making a tidy profit
from one of his books (in fact, I have). A sample of prices from the L.W.
Currey catalogue:
"Carrie...Doubleday 1974...w/brief inscription...$350.00"
 
"The Dark Tower:The Gunslinger...Grant 1981...one of 500 signed
copies...$500.00"
 
"Night Shift...Doubleday 1978...$600.00"
 
Kind of speaks for itself.

Message: 1604
Author: $ Mark Adkins
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: P.K.D.
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 02:02:48

I'm not a fan (never read him), but here's some info for those who might be
interested:
 
Now in stock from Underwood-Miller (515 Chestnut St. Columbia, PA
17512-1233);
 
The Collected Stories of Phillip K. Dick...All of P.K.D. short and medium
length fiction (5 volumes...900,000+ words), including some previously
unpublished stories. 416 pages each volume (6 1/2 x 9 1/2). Five volume set
is $125.00, limited (100 copies) deluxe edition in slipcase w/signature,
$350.00
 
I believe they also published a biography, for all you hardcore P.K.D. fans.

Message: 1605
Author: $ Nick Ianuzzi
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Art bored
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 02:22:03

Just what I need, some fresh input.

Message: 1606
Author: $ Mike Howerton
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: king
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 04:47:30

Yeah, it is the  Grant edition.
Dark Tower II was just released from Grant.
I did hear a wild rumour that all of the Dark Tower stuff would be 
released  in paperback within a year or so.
It will only affect the value of  the second printing hardcovers.

Message: 1607
Author: $ Mike Howerton
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: lesson
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 04:48:53

You know me, it takes me forever  to learn all of that
common sense stuff.
It ran through my head real quick at the time that he was
bluffing.  I  guess calling people's bluff is not a good idea.

Message: 1608
Author: $ Alan Hamilton
Category: Entertainment
Subject: The Belgariad
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 07:39:47

  True, Silk is a snide little devil.  His smart remarks are one of the
book's great strengths.  However, I can't stand Ce'nedra.  I hate bitchy
litte kids, and that's what she strike me as (and at times, Garion too).
 
     /
 /  *  /  Alan
*     *

Message: 1609
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Traci.Nick
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 09:57:30

Thanks for the votes. It's looking good. --- ANN ---

Message: 1610
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Mike Howerton
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 09:59:10

I called your house regarding those King papers - got a recording that said
I'd be talking to the president!! He never did call back!! --- ANN ---

Message: 1611
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Cliff
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 10:01:46

I also mentioned other boards like a poetry and story one. ___ Well, can
those just be in the art board too? It doesn;t have to be just drawings. Is
there enough votes yet? --- ANN ---

Message: 1612
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: James Taranto
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 10:05:46

You might get a little ribbing once in a while - probablly from the ones
that do not use the art board. Only the ones that do can appriciate how hard
it is to create anykind of drawing on a word processer!! I still havn't got
the hang of it but like to try. Looks to me like you've done it before -
right? --- ANN ---
P.S. Hope Cliff gives us at least 40 lines to work with.

Message: 1613
Author: $ James Taranto
Category: Answer!
Subject: Ann
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 18:07:26

****************
*            *    *
*********** ********
**********************
********* *       *
************** ** *
*******************

Message: 1614
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Answer!
Subject: James T.
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 19:36:18

    33333333$$$$$$$$((((((())) 
                        ******  ****** *****
    OOO OOO OOO       #################################

.......999)))((()))((( ---ANN---

Message: 1615
Author: $ Traci Sibel
Category: Question?
Subject: for all you
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 22:25:23

knowledgeable people out there......

              X
              !
              !
              +-\/\----------------------------------Y
              0       150  160  170  180  190  200

What is the offiicial name of the little squiggly up there that denotes a
break in frequency?

(no joke, I don't know the answer, but it's worth 5 pts Extra Credit..)

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Message: 412
Author: $ Chris Zagar
Category: For sale
Subject: MIDI Synthesizer
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 09:17:53

I am selling a Yamaha PSR-60 synthesizer.  This synth features a four-octave
full-sized keyboard, 16 stereo and 16 monophonic voices (one of each may be
selected at a time) and 16 rhythms with 3 fill-ins per rhythm.  It also
features MIDI in and out jacks for connection to other synths or computers
such as the Atari 520ST or 1040ST.  It has a memory for recording music, and
can save/load compositions to/from a tape recorder through provided jacks. 
It can operate off of either 110 AC or batteries and has built-in speakers
and jacks for external speakers or headphones.  All sounds are digital PCM
produced for accurate reproduction.

I am asking $500.  If interested, please leave me mail.

SYSOP Chris

A

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Message: 1126
Author: $ David Burkhart
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: last
Date: 07/22/87  Time: 01:11:52

They broke up.  Sting, Copeland and Summers are now persuing solo careers.
Do I have to call all three of them?

Message: 1127
Author: $ Nikki Kalua
Category: Question?
Subject: Sandy/ask me
Date: 07/23/87  Time: 00:51:07

NOT YOU TOO!   I know nothing about the kiss from Cliff or slavery.
I don't get into that kinky stuff.

Message: 1128
Author: $ Sandy SYSOP
Category: Answer!
Subject: Kinky
Date: 07/23/87  Time: 11:25:41

My, My, My, My, My ..........
        I fear that someone is reading between the lines.
Oh, dear! Oh, my gosh! My, goodness!

Cliff is my slave because of 'spousal rape' (kissing me while I was asleep
and unable to give my consent). I now have the power to throw the 'bum' in
jail ..... He-he. One wrong move from Cliff ...... and ....... CLANK! there
goes the metal jail doors.

Speaking of Kinky stuff ........... how can you write such sensuous stories
without getting involved with Kinky stuff? If you do not write from memory,
then do you go out on field trips at night and study the species?
                        (joke, joke)

Message: 1129
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: Klif's Kiss
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 02:40:23

Where did he kiss you?  It might have been sodomy as well.

Oh well.

Message: 1130
Author: $ Traci Sibel
Category: Chit-Chat
Subject: poor sandy
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 23:02:57

run away & find 7 dwarfs.....

HI HO! HI HO! It's off to bed I go!!

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Message: 45293
Author: $ Rod Williams
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: Billi
Date: 07/22/87  Time: 00:53:34

Durants on North Central was quiet and Billi and I had a corner all to 
ourselves, I opened the conversation.  "Billi, you made a decent point at 
our last get together, but I am more like the US Army 45's compared to the 
German Luger, I do tend to blow them away a bit rather than just drill these
small holes through them."
  "Gee, Rod, you really are a handsome fellow, our last din-din was in a 
dark restaurant and I hadn't noticed, so what's new?"
  "Well, Billi, I was just thinking, it would seem to me that if the 
Christian heaven/hell concept is true then that would mean there is a very 
big sadistic streak in the followers, or else they are just unaware of the 
facts"
  "How's that, please explain yourself Rod?"
  "Simple, really simple, Billi, as a matter of fact, most all tough 
problems have the very simplest answers, but to continue, take for instance 
any ole Christian at all and put them in heaven for eternity, okay?"  
  "Now," I continued, how do you think the person would feel about the 
non-christians being in hell forever, say 10,000 years passed and the person
is still being punished, and the Christian knows this full well, wouldn't or
better yet, shouldn't it bother that person?"  "Wouldn't you bother you, I 
know it would bother the hell out of me."
  "So, to continue, is not my summation correct, have merit, mean anything?"
  "Okay Rod", chimes Billi, "That is a simple one, you have not taken your 
blinders off, I see, the answer is obvious."   When a Christian goes through
the Pearly Gates, they toss their brains in a big box."  "See?"

Message: 45294
Author: Lance Allen
Category: Bulletins
Subject: FOX BBS
Date: 07/23/87  Time: 23:14:19

Hello people, 
  I'd just to announce that FOX COMM is back up and running
on a COCO 3 with 3 drives etc..So give it a call and try it
out....! The number is 482-7458 Free on-line dloads & games
etc..
  Again the number    = 4 8 2 - 7 4 5 8 =
                        '''''''''''''''
       Later...,
             L.A.

Message: 45295
Author: Ryan Oli
Category: In search of
Subject: skating
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 00:34:37

        ATTENTION SKATERS
   This is Ryan Oli and I'm looking
for a few fellow skaters to get to
know on this board. So PLEASE write
me if you skate.
B.J.
e a
s m
t              OLi

Message: 45296
Author: $ Mark Adkins
Category: Answer!
Subject: J.T.
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 01:33:11

No, all of conclusions are based on false assumptions. For example, it

simply wasn't stated that there would be no paint in the universe. It was
stated that everything would be blue, including the paint. This takes care
of the difficulties involving a paintless universe.
 
Now then, please tender me the keys to the bread locker.

Message: 45297
Author: $ Mark Adkins
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Billi
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 01:38:29

Actually, if you define "God" as an omnipotent being, it is (and has been
shown to be) a self-contradictory, and thus invalid concept. If you define
"God" as a being of finite, but greater relative power than humans, you have
defined nothing; since everything can appear "godlike" in terms of relative
power to something else. You might as well say "God is everything".
Meaningless.
 
 
"Once I swam across a lake of fire merely to notify an old woman that the
calamity she dreaded was unlikely to occur."
 
       ---Cugel the Clever

Message: 45298
Author: Billi Idyll
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: Jim White
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 06:22:28

        I smiled easily as Jim chowed down.  "I do admire your attempt to
bring this conversation to a rational basis, but I fear you have put forward
one precept that I cannot allow you.  You say you cannot allow the New
Testament to be put forward as a historical document.  While I will allow
that it accurately recounts SOME events that took place in the past, I do
not think we can consider it HISTORICAL TRUTH."
        Jim choked and quickly sipped some 7UP, but I gave him no chance to
respond before I continued.  "Homer Oddessy, for example, covers
historically valid facts and events, but includes the gods being interwoven
into the tale.  Why is the bible more valid than it.  Or Geoffry of Monmouth
obvious fabrications: why should be believe it as opposed, say, to Caesar's
accounts of the conquest of Britain?"
        Jim was turning blue, but I pressed on.  "The fact is, Jim, old boy,
that Jesus WAS an obscure philosopher.  It was less of a phenomenon than
Judas Macabees, and hardly rose above the pack of messiahs running around
Palestine during those days.  St. Paul is the man who promoted him and his
teaching and made him a world messiah.  Even so, there is very interesting
work, like "Holy Blood, Holy Grail," that suggests Christ never died (and
that his bloodline continues yet today in France)."
        As Jim passed out from rational overload, I finished with, "So, if
you want to claim rationality, let's get down to verifiable facts, not
fables.  Otherwise, if you want the New Testament, I want the Oddessey, The
Bo Tain, and, oh say, the Book of Moron..."j

Message: 45299
Author: Billi Idyll
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: Rod Williams
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 06:30:38

        "D's is a nice place," I told Rod,"And your observations about
Christians are interesting.  Still, I'd not limit God just because his
followers have ideosyncracies.  As God told meat a recent lunch, the
Christians have forgotten that before he made them 'enlightened' he first
made them men."
        Rod nodded.  "Hey, if you want to waste the brain sweat believing,
that's no skin off my nose."
        I smiled.  "I find believing in something unrational is useful while
my work has me doing things like logical programs or has me creating fantasy
worlds..."
        Rod smiled and stretched.  "So, do you think you'll need my 'Luger"
approach with Jim White?"
        I shrugged.  "If he continues to insist the bible is more than a
collection of stories and folk wisdom, yes, because our conversation ends
there."
        Rod looked at me incredulously.  "You expect it to go any further?"
        I smiled.  "Maybe.  Remember, before God made Jim 'holier than you
or me' he did make him part of the human race."
        Rod shook his head.  "Don't remind me: I can't stand the idea of
sharing a species with him..."

Message: 45300
Author: $ James White
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: Billi Idyll
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 08:38:05

     I chuckled inside as I realized that Billi thought I was having
a "rational overload" when in fact I was trying to keep a straight
face.  I regained my composure enough to ask, "Billi, do you really
think that what you just said makes any sense?"
     "Well of course" Billi said with his all-knowing smile intact,
"I'm perfectly rational, remember?"
     "Oh yes" I replied.  "But the number of unproven assumptions
that just reached my ears is not.  Would you allow me the opportunity
of responding to them?"
     "I suppose so.  I guess I've baited you sufficiently."
     "Why thank you."  I sighed deeply, wondering if Billi really was
as ignorant of the real facts as he was acting.  Could he be baiting
me again?  Who knows?  I know there are people who really accept that
kind of fairy-tale history being pushed by people like Wells, Allegro,
and Baigent, but Billi just doesn't seem that silly.  Oh well, fools
rush in...  
     "First, you did not address any of the issues relevant to the
historical accuracy of the New Testament and its value as a witness
to the existence of Jesus.  You're simple statement that you will not
accept the NT as being accurate does not mean anything to anyone but
yourself, you must realize that.  Tell me, Billi, have you ever read
"Roman Society and Roman Law in the New Testament" by A.N. Sherwin-
White?  He is a reader in ancient history at the University of Oxford."
     "Eh, can't say that I have."

Message: 45301
Author: $ James White
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: Billi cont.
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 08:39:37

     "Oh, that's too bad.  Have you read anything by F.F. Bruce - I
know Jim Lippard calls him "ultra conservative" but if Bruce is ultra
conservative John Allegro is mainline."
     "Who?" Billi asked, never losing his all-knowing smile.
     "Never mind.  Billi, you will have to deal with brass tacks to
convince me that there is no value in the NT as an historical witness
to the life and ministry of Jesus Christ.  You will have to deal with
the dating of the text, formation of canon, patristic citations, etc.
Are you prepared to do that?"
     "Oh come on Jim" Billi chuckled, "don't be ridiculous."
     "I'm not being ridiculous, Billi.  I'm asking for facts.  I'm asking
for a little objectivity here.  You mentioned the Odyssey in the same 
breath as the NT.  Surely you can't be serious, can you?  You can read
Acts, with its intricate recording of historical detail (rulers, places,
roads, sea lanes, etc. and etc.) and place it on the same level as Homer?
Lets get reasonable here, Billi."
     "Well what about his being an obscure philosopher?"
     "I suppose if Jesus had lived in Rome he would have made a big
enough splash to impress you, but he didn't.  Acts says that by the mid
50's there was a large population of Christians in Rome.  That's pretty
quick growth for a movement with no founder.  And Billi - talking about
Baigent, Leigh, and Lincoln's fantasy work "The Holy Blood and the Holy
Grail"???  No truly reputable scholar would give that the time of day!
Talk about unfounded assumptions, presuppositions and fantasy!"


Message: 45302
Author: $ James White
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: Billi last
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 08:40:10

     As Billi was beginning to slip under the table from real 
rational overload, I finished off the last meatball and reached
for my slice of chocolate cake.  "And by the way, Billi, as you
said yourself, let's get down to verifiable facts, not fables.
You were exactly right.  "Holy Blood, Holy Grail" is myth and
fable, not fact.  Lets deal with facts.  How about it Billi?"
    Billi's head disappeared from view.  I was somewhat embarrassed
by the scene, but I hoped that Billi would regain consciousness
soon.  We had only just begun our conversation, and I was sure
that he had more bait in his box.

Message: 45303
Author: $ James White
Category: Religion
Subject: Lippard11
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 10:18:45

     On page 13 of "Fundamentalism is Nonsense" Jim briefly discusses
the massacre of children under Herod and states, "no historian mentioned
any such massacre."  This is untrue.  Matthew wrote about it.  On what
basis does Jim insist that Matthew is not to be trusted?  Much of the
skeptical material is laced through and through with these kind of
negative presuppositions that assume the outcome of the argument in
order to prove the argument, which is, of course, circular reasoning.
Even if one does not like to allow Matthew his place (how many historical
events are based on only one source and yet we don't question them - like
about half of all of Roman history?) then we need to remember that
"absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."  Ever heard that before?
     On page 14 Jim has a topic entitled "Birth of Jesus."  This 
section is representative of much of the book.  The assumed position is
that by saying "In Matthew, the angel visits Joseph; in Luke, he visits
Mary" that somehow a contradiction is implicit.  The underlying 
assumption is that the writers of these documents did not know one
another and were ignorant of the real events.  Also, this kind of
writing assumes that there is no such thing as harmonization.  This
fallacy is rampant throughout anti-theist writings, and unfortunate
fact.  Why could not the angel have visited BOTH Mary and Joseph and
Matthew record one visit and Luke the other?  More could be said on
this, but that's enough for the present.

Message: 45304
Author: $ Jim Lippard
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: induction
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 10:41:51

Absence of evidence most certainly is evidence of absence.  There is no
evidence of an elephant in this room, that is very good evidence that there
is in fact no elephant in this room.
   Absence of evidence is not DEDUCTIVE evidence of absence, but it is
inductive evidence.

Message: 45305
Author: $ Jim Lippard
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: gospels' genre
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 10:49:14

The genre of the gospels is not history.  This is a very mainstream
position.  They are a collection of preachings, teachings, and inspirational
stories.

Message: 45306
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: ...The Gang
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 16:31:08

    I sipped quietly at my Yoo-Hoo(tm) and peeked across the restaurant
where two funny-looking men were sitting.  One looked like "Joe
Pineapple-Head" (Billi) and the other looked like a white Bill Cosby (J.
White).  They seemed to be arguing.
    Across from me sat Rot Williams.
    "Drain bamage, no?"
    "Uh huh, Rod."
    We began listening.  Tales of historical evidence and circular reasoning
filled my clean and Rod's filthy-waxy ears.  It soon became apparent that
they were not only answering the wrong questions, but gritting their teeth.
     James sucked a meatball up his straw.  "Look, bub, if you were a REAL
scholar, you'd know that..."
    "Oh Jaymess.  Want some WORRRMS???"  He dangled a couple of
nightcrawlers in front of James' squinched-up face, which James quickly
consumed, mixing the fleshy worm-tissue with the chocolate cake lingering in
his mouth from earlier.
    "YOU'RE the one who was BAITED! Ha HA!!!"  It was true.  When Billi
smiled, it became apparent that he had a horse fly lodged between his
teeth.  Seeing this bugged me slightly.
    "Oh YEAH?" said Billi, as he violently twisted the napkin in his lap. 
"Well my obscure philosopher can lick your obscure philosopher!"
    "Sez who?!"
    "Sez ME, spinach breath."
    "I know you are, but what am I?"

Message: 45307
Author: $ Zak Woodruff
Category: My Dinner with...
Subject: ...The Gang, cont.
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 16:47:54

    Needless to say, the sight was incredibly disgusting, so Rod and I left
for fear of the ever-embarassing double vomit.
    "What do you think, Rod?  I mean, are such arguments worth pursuing when
both sides are positive they're right and this assuredness shines through in
the form of condescending crapola?"
    "I don't know.  But I must say, it sure is amusing.  Better than
wrestling."
    "That's true."


I await the next series of "Dinner" messages with baited breath.

Message: 45308
Author: $ Apro Poet
Category: In search of
Subject: Life
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 17:32:29

  There are two immense words from Indo-European, *gene* and
*bheu*, each a virtual anthill in itself, from which we have
constructed the notion of Everything.  At the beginning, or
as far back as they are traceable, they meant something like
being.  *Gene* signified beginning, giving birth, while
*bheu* indicated existence and growth.  *Gene* turned itself
successively into *kundjaz* (Germanic) and *gecynd* (Old 
English), meaning kin or kind.  Kind was at first a family 
connection, later an elevated social rank, and finally came
to rest meaning kindly or gentle.  Meanwhile, a branch of
*gene* became the Latin *gens*, then gentle itself; it also
emerged as genus, genius, genital, and generous; then, still
holding on to its inner significance, it became "nature" 
(out of *gnasci*).
  While gene was evolving into "nature" and "kind," *bheu*
was moving through similar transformations.  One branch 
became *bowan* in Germanic and *bua* in Old Norse, meaning to
live and dwell, and then the English word build.  It moved
into Greek, as *phuein*, meaning to bring forth and make
grow; then as *phusis*, which was another word for nature.
*Phusis* became the source of physic, which at first meant
natural science and later was the word for medicine.  Still
later, physic became physics.
  Both words, at today's stage of their evolution, can be

Message: 45309
Author: $ Apro Poet
Category: In search of
Subject: Life
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 17:44:13

taken together to mean, literally, everything in the 
universe.  You do not come by words like this easily; they
cannot just be made up from scratch.  They need long lives
before they can signify.  "Everything," C. S. Lewis observed
in a discussion of the words, "is a subject on which there 
is not much to be said."  The words themselves must show the
internal marks of long use; they must contain their own
inner conversation.
  These days it is reassuring to know that nature and 
physics, in their present meanings, have been interconnected
in our minds, by a sort of hunch, for all these years.  The
other words clinging to them are a puzzlement, but nice to
see.  If you let your mind relax, all the words will flow 
into each other in an amiable sort of nonsense.  "Kind" 
means a relation, but it also means "nature."  The word for
kind is the same as the word for gentle.  Even "physics," 
save us, is a kind of "nature," by its nature, and is,
simultaneously, another kind of kind.  There are ancient 
ideas reverberating through this structure, very old 
hunches.
  It is part of the magic of language that some people can
get to the same place by the use of totally different words.
Julian of Norwich, a fourteenth-century hermitess, said it 
so well that a paragraph of hers was used recently by a

Message: 45310
Author: $ Apro Poet
Category: In search of
Subject: Life
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 17:48:17

physicist for his introduction to a hard-science review of
contemporary cosmological physics: "He showed me a little
thing, the quantity of a hazelnut, in the palm of my hand,
and it was as round as a ball.  I looked thereupon with eye
of my understanding and thought: What may this be?  And it
was answered generally thus: it is all that is made."

Message: 45311
Author: $ Jim Lippard
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Homer
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 17:58:16

BTW, the Iliad and the Odyssey do contain detail and historical facts.  The
Trojan War really did occur, as archaeologists have uncovered the city of
Troy and other sites of direct relevance to the story of the Iliad.
(Some interesting stuff about the Iliad may be found in the beginning of
Julian Jaynes' "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the
Bicameral Mind".)

Message: 45312
Author: $ James Taranto
Category: Question?
Subject: Adkins
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 18:05:24

If everything were blue, what would be the point of painting anything?

Message: 45313
Author: $ John Henry
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Blaspheme
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 18:30:41

Blasphemy is a victimless crime.
  -Hienlen
 
Swing 'Dat Hamma
 -John Henry

Message: 45314
Author: $ Ann Oudin
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: James/colors
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 19:34:16

For a contrast!! -- ANN ---

Message: 45315
Author: $ Laura Lansberry
Category: Chit Chat
Subject: Julian Jaynes
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 20:11:44

Nice man ... Harvard Prof.  Wrote to him once, we exchanged a couple of
letters, very approachable man. Discussed facets of the bicameral mind
relative to a current developing awareness not found in everyone, much as
introspective thought replaced the muses ... 
I think your debates are a bit cutesy. All that rancor and anger from both
Christians and Atheists trying to prove their opinions are Divine.
You who have never been wrong in your life cast the first stone ... and then
the rest of us will know who to throw stones back at.
Love you all ... I vote for an ART BOARD ... which is why I visited and now
GOETZ is the vote? Who cares?

Message: 45316
Author: $ James White
Category: Religion
Subject: Lippard's deduction
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 20:30:23

You would be right if you had omniscience concerning all that was taking
place in the ancient world - but you don't.  You can look at all the data
concerning what is and what is not in your room - you do not know the names
and addresses of everyone who lived in Galilee or Judea two millenia ago. 
Watch your assumptions Jim - they are glaringly obvious.
     As to the "genre" of the gospels - true, the gospels contain preaching,
stories, etc., but don't forget that the events of the gospel are
intricately tied to historical events, people, and places.  Indeed, when
Paul went out preaching the gospel he did not say "come have the same
experience I have had" he said "this happened in history - you can check it
out - go talk to the 500+ witnesses of the resurrection of the Lord."
     And finally, do you really think that the Iliad is of the same "genre"
as Acts?  Seriously?
James>>>

Message: 45317
Author: $ Traci Sibel
Category: Question?
Subject: Holy Blood/Grail
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 22:52:36

Where does one find more info on this?

Message: 45318
Author: $ Carol Graham
Category: Question?
Subject: rod
Date: 07/24/87  Time: 23:51:03

Since there is no God in your concept, why do you
continually lay the blame on God for all of the
world's woes?
 
If your were God, you would not allow little children
to be hurt, nor would you allow all these people to
starve, ad infinitum in your arguments all these years.
How many times I have read your other argument concerning
a god who would put some of his children in heaven and they
will all ignore the ones suffering eternally in hell.
 
Gosh, for one who keeps telling us that he is evolving, I
haven't seen one bit of new thought in any of your posts.
How ma